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  #1  
Old 07-02-2012, 03:47 PM
bigbike-r bigbike-r is offline
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Default registering a custom

1..I know the easiest way to register a custom frame is to aqquire a headstock and v5 and have that welded to the new frame - use the old numbers and the v5 - not strictly legal and if the MOT-er is a cunt he could inform the dvla that the frame is modified extensively, wich would call for an msva anyway

2.. if you decided to take the above route but already had a frame without a stamped headstock, what are the consequences of getting cought if you bought a frame with v5 - stamped the numbers onto your new frame and destroyed the old frame

3.. the msva requires allsorts of bullshit like e marked lights etc - can you turn up for one with the basics of a running bike ie without lights - much the same as turning up for MOT for a daytime only.

who's registered their frames here and what was required etc
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Old 07-02-2012, 04:28 PM
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ok one last time, MSVA DOES NOT NEED E MARKED LIGHTS

god it makes my piss boil hearing people spouting stuff about the MSVA

its a piece of piss test, its a one off test, no MOT for 3 years.

you get a properly registered bike that in the future will be worth more money

the full VOSA inspection manual is online and free to download

if you have to try and think of ways to get around the MSVA because you cant build a bike thats capable of passing it, then just bin your tools as you dont deserve them anyway
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Old 07-02-2012, 04:50 PM
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a short blunt and to the point reply, so basically there is no need to worry around it, ive only really gone off hearsay from others who have said its all regulation this e marks that and certain standards - im gonna have a dig about around the msva guidelines and vosa

if the case is your correct then piece of piss....... talking of piss, get yourself to a doctor man, ive never heard of a case of boiling piss

thanks for the reply
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Old 07-02-2012, 05:26 PM
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LOL no probs, I was just on a trike site and getting irate after being ignored on there about some very simple facts, then came on here and had a keyboard bashing session LOL

yes there are regs, but they are all very simple to follow and easily laid out

the manual is on the VOSA site, search vosa MSVA manual in google etc and download the .pdf

its totally free and its the same manual that your tester will be using

MSVA rules are simple, if it says something about it, then follow it

this is about construction, not condition, its totally farcical in some areas, tyres can be bald, so long as they are of the correct speeed rating


probably the 3 mains things to look out for are

noise levels, just make it quiet as possibel, its only for one day of its life
fuel cap projection, flush filler in a custom tank solves this
external projections, this is about sharp edges and radiuses etc
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Old 07-02-2012, 05:42 PM
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As Tony says the manual is free the test easy. and if you need help with interpretation I was a MSVA examiner a couple of years back.

It's all common sense. Everything needs to be secure so if you need temporary wiring for a lamp that might get moved, fit it properly.

It don't need custom paintwork to pass, so it's ok to turn up with the bike in primer, then if you need to change something it's not heart breaking.
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Old 07-02-2012, 07:09 PM
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what i want toknow is these idiots are happy to take rumours as gospel - why not get of ya arse and go down to your local vosa office - you will find they are very polite and will answer your questons from the horses mouth not from a rumor mill !

Yep i was dead against the test but afterwardss when all the bullshit had died down and the real facts emerged - i am in favour of it !
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Old 07-02-2012, 08:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Creature View Post
what i want toknow is these idiots are happy to take rumours as gospel - why not get of ya arse and go down to your local vosa office
can't answer for other "idiots" but "this idiot" works 12+hour night shifts 5 and 6 days a week so its easier to just ask on a forum and obtain the information later.
been posted in the workshop section on here i thought thats what this part of the forum was for
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Old 07-02-2012, 08:42 PM
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Q plated log books sometimes come up on ebay so you dont have to build twice, but if not you will have to build for the test and then rebuild after you have got your log book. Its all about the right kind of mirror and how noisey it is and crap like that. Not hard to pass but if you want to build something minimal be prepared to put in the work after.

I do know a couple of people that have taken standard bikes to the sva and then used the bits to build what they want after using the donor bike once they have their Q plate and nondescript model on the log book.
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Old 07-02-2012, 10:40 PM
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ive had a quick read of the msva manual, it seems that lighting doesnt have to be e marked but must produce the correct beam, colour and be positioned correctly and securely

the only mentioning of a failing of any item on the bike that i can see was the exhaust system, must be clearly e-marked or carry a plaque or other permanent marking with the manufacturers details on - so a custom exhaust is out the window really? it must be secured - silenced etc the rest is pretty much childs play - making sure everything is properley secured - in the correct position, mirrors are of correct size seems pretty much just the requirements that youd expect of any bike you were going to ride
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Old 07-02-2012, 11:23 PM
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The thing that causes confusion over E marks is that the manual asks for lamps that provide the same colour as an E marked lamp.

So if your tail lamp is E marked job done. If it isn't we compare it to an E marked lamp.

It has to produce red light.................

Not very radical is it ?

Same with mirrors is it E marked or "like" an E marked mirror.

Exhausts are trickier because they have to bear a manufacturers mark. Doesn't have to be the full name just a trade mark will do and it can be the Exhaust manufacturer or the bikes manufacturer.
It also has to pas a noise test. This is measured using a sound meter 500mm from the tail pipe. Short systems struggle cos the engine is closer and the meter picks up mechanical noise as well as exhaust noise.

The eurocrats brought in type approval, msva provides a legal way of getting a one off registered. The manual was written by bikers within the constraints of the euro regulations. It may not stay as user friendly in the future cos the eurocrats are sniffing around it. They recently made the car SVA much tighter and killed off the grey imports from japan.

The test as it is may not be loved by everyone but it was the best that could be achieved once type approval became law.

I don't do MSVA testing any more but try to keep up to date.
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Old 08-02-2012, 12:40 AM
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yeah it is pretty clear in the manual to be fair - under lights it says something along the lines of - if the light displays an e mark it automatically passes points 2 4 and 6 or whatever and then goes on for lights not displaying any e marks and describes what to look for

its just the exhausts - the frame is from hardupchoppers and he makes exhausts to suit the engine/frame combo but they arent marked or baffled as far as i know - universal baffle would sort the silencer on the msva but it may be that i have to get a plaque made with hardupchoppers engraved/embossed and pop rivett it to the pipe? if that would be suffice of course. the pipes are going to be loud - i think this will be my set back when it comes to registering

to be honest i cant see why peiople are against the msva - it seems pretty straight forward and easy and ensures your bike meets the standards required/aint a death trap - its the way im going to go anyway - any extra i have to spend will probably be saved on the 3 years i dont have to get an mot wich is what 120 quid? 40 quid per year
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Old 08-02-2012, 07:21 AM
devon-tony devon-tony is offline
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Simplez
exhaust just needs a makers mark. Knock up a pair of silencers for it from a standard bike. These will shut it up but also bear markings.
In my experience you havent a chance of getting it thru with simple baffles.
Take it for test in rattle can paint. Then its easy to strip and do properlyy once its passed.
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Old 08-02-2012, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by devon-tony View Post
Simplez
exhaust just needs a makers mark. Knock up a pair of silencers for it from a standard bike. These will shut it up but also bear markings.
In my experience you havent a chance of getting it thru with simple baffles.
Take it for test in rattle can paint. Then its easy to strip and do properlyy once its passed.
What he said
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Old 08-02-2012, 02:31 PM
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cant get a can on the pipes - as theyre not 4 into 2 theyre just 4 lol - i dunno what clearence issues tehre are to get a standard pipework on - if i can i may have to borrow someones standard setup to push it through
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Old 08-02-2012, 02:43 PM
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yeah its as simple as that, pick up a stock system off ebay, even a damaged or rusty one, cut it about as required, bodge it on, so long as its secure and quiet, its job done

or you could put some effort into it, pair of simple 2-1 collectors that you push and clamp onto butlers pipes, then connected to a silencer each side.

not only does this mean you can get it through MSVA, but simple fix back on for MOT time
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Old 08-02-2012, 05:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by devon-tony View Post
yeah its as simple as that, pick up a stock system off ebay, even a damaged or rusty one, cut it about as required, bodge it on, so long as its secure and quiet, its job done

or you could put some effort into it, pair of simple 2-1 collectors that you push and clamp onto butlers pipes, then connected to a silencer each side.

not only does this mean you can get it through MSVA, but simple fix back on for MOT time
Swapping parts just to fraudulently pass a test put there by government officials for your safety and the good of the planet.

Disgraceful.
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Old 08-02-2012, 06:03 PM
bigbike-r bigbike-r is offline
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lol although the safety of an exhaust is IMO bollocks if anything, been a touch louder is better. at least it makes other road users more aware of your presence - kinda like a dipped beam used to till they decided to fit DLR's to everything so we blended in.
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Old 09-02-2012, 01:17 PM
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Sorry to hyjack your thread Dan

What is the situation with an existing hardtail frame that has numbers stamped on the headstock but not q plated?, can those same numbers be used for re-registering or does it require new numbers and a ballsed up paint job?
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Old 09-02-2012, 01:42 PM
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What frame Dave, if its a frame that has been modified to be a hardtail, I think so long as the main cradle of the frame remains the same, you can register it on the same plate
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Old 09-02-2012, 02:18 PM
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If the hardtail is welded onto a standard cradle it needs q plating, bolt ons dont.

my yellow chop came with a gsx V5 *cough*

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Old 09-02-2012, 03:59 PM
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technically yes that should have been MSVA tested, but if you go down that road, then so should about 90% of custom bikes
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Old 09-02-2012, 04:04 PM
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I know it should mate, it's something I want to get sorted but can't be arsed at the mo. What I need to know is will they have to give me new frame numbers or can I re-register with the existing ones?
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Old 09-02-2012, 04:11 PM
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it will be stupid if you have to grind out the old ones, id imagine theyll use the old numbers and asign it to a new reg?
youll need another mirror and indicators though

im a bit miffed over the security section of the msva - has to be a device other than a steering lock, surely you dont have to fit an alarm or immobiliser
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Old 09-02-2012, 04:16 PM
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yes you will need new numbers, one beginning SABTV

Ive not looked at the security for bikes, is it different to trikes?
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Old 09-02-2012, 04:17 PM
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just got my manual out, steering lock is fine
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Old 09-02-2012, 04:36 PM
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Ive got one custom bike build left on the easy route, was feeling ill and couldnt sleep, surfed ebay very early hours, found a Q plate frame and V5 25

snapped that up

wifes trike is MSVA route, its easy anyway
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Old 09-02-2012, 04:37 PM
Dave Sausages Dave Sausages is offline
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I can handle fitting another mirror, indys and full size can, it's scraping off the paint to stamp new numbers which will bother me. It's got no steering lock either. poo

Last edited by Dave Sausages; 09-02-2012 at 04:41 PM.
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Old 09-02-2012, 04:54 PM
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in the manual i have it says security must be other than a steering lock and lists it as a reason for failure - i may have read the wrong section though but ATM cant check cos its downloaded on the other laptop that sprung a virus lastnight and now wont start-up

thats a bitch about the numbers dave, i was gonna sudgest welding a plate but its same situation really, is it powder coated or painted?
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Old 09-02-2012, 04:59 PM
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Unauthorised Use
June 2010 7/1
7
Application
This inspection applies to all vehicles with the exception of mopeds. However, if a device is fitted to a moped it must meet the requirements below.
Notes.

The device may be mechanical or electrical, or an electronic immobiliser or a combination of these in addition to any switch normally used to start the engine.

Mechanical devices must act positively to lock the steering or transmission system or both.
Requirements and Procedures
1. Check that the vehicle is fitted with an operational device or system intended to prevent the unauthorised use of the vehicle such that it shall be necessary to disable it in order to point, drive or move the vehicle straight ahead.2. Check that any device fitted does not act on any part of the braking system.
3. Check that the protective device cannot accidentally jam when the vehicle is in motion.


Reasons for Failure
1. A vehicle not fitted with an operational device preventing unauthorised use of the vehicle or, where a mechanical device is fitted, it does not act on the steering or the transmission or both
2. A device that acts upon the vehicle braking system.
3. The device is likely to jam when the vehicle is in motion.



**********************************************
the failure section is for having a mechanical device that isnt on the steering or transmission.
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Old 09-02-2012, 05:01 PM
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if you dont have steering locks then the easy route would be to fit one of them rally style battery disconnecting devices, maybe in the side of the leccy box

failing that a cheapy remote alarm/immob from ebay, then remove it.

the first test I did they allowed me to use a padlock and chain, but only because it was carried on the trike in a tool roll
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