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  #31  
Old 07-10-2010, 07:18 PM
matthewmosse matthewmosse is offline
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I've seen a few trikes in car parks etc at rallies that sport single disk on the driveshaft rather than the usual place so someone's done it. Connected to a component likely to fail is a bit of a subjective ruling, a chain is farily likely as they wear and streach, a driveshaft, particuarly a ridgid setup with no universal joints to wear out is quite unlikely to fail - obviously assuming it's made right! Also worth bearing in mind the power output on that point - a landrover rear axle could take all maner of abuse and high power outputs and would be highly unlikely to fail if used in conjunction with say a xs400 engine
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  #32  
Old 08-10-2010, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matthewmosse View Post
I've seen a few trikes in car parks etc at rallies that sport single disk on the driveshaft rather than the usual place so someone's done it. Connected to a component likely to fail is a bit of a subjective ruling, a chain is farily likely as they wear and streach, a driveshaft, particuarly a ridgid setup with no universal joints to wear out is quite unlikely to fail - obviously assuming it's made right! Also worth bearing in mind the power output on that point - a landrover rear axle could take all maner of abuse and high power outputs and would be highly unlikely to fail if used in conjunction with say a xs400 engine
I agree with you, it's been done, most quads have single disc
on a drive shaft.

And yes most things like this are subjective... Thats the problem.

A jag rear end aint likely to fail when stopping a trike.

The problem comes when presented with a one off......How strong is it?

My only concern here is when investing huge amounts of time effort and money in a project, to then find you have a chance of it being rejected for the reasons stated. That's gonna hurt.

I know 'cos I've seen it first hand.
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  #33  
Old 08-10-2010, 05:08 PM
4_stroke 4_stroke is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harry View Post
I agree with you, it's been done, most quads have single disc
on a drive shaft.
The quads I have seen with a single disc do not have a diff, they use a solid axle. This is possible because of the narrow track.

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  #34  
Old 08-10-2010, 07:12 PM
4_stroke 4_stroke is offline
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Originally Posted by harry View Post
Jag and Citroen stopped using inboard disks when type approval came in.
Jag stopped using in-board discs in 1993/4 (I was a project engineer on the 1993 model year XJS), type approval came in long before that. You can tell which one it is because it is the one with the profiled plastic bumpers. In the jag installation if the joint failed the suspension would collapse. But the type of joint used is a UJ which inherently fail safe. Itís a good neat set up. The only weakness was the diff in the V12 version. Not a problem for a trike.
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  #35  
Old 08-10-2010, 10:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matthewmosse View Post
I've seen a few trikes in car parks etc at rallies that sport single disk on the driveshaft rather than the usual place so someone's done it.
I've seen disc's on drive shafts too but they were for the hand brake.
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  #36  
Old 09-10-2010, 04:45 PM
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but due to how a diff works a disk brake on just one of the output shafts will only brake the wheel on that shaft, leaving the other wheel on the other side of the diff as an unbraked one. as has been said, most(though not all) quads on the road dont have a differential drive to the back wheels, so a single disk will operate on both wheels on the same axle. its pretty basic engineering stuff. if you know how a diff works then you know why you will need a disk on each wheel. even a handbrake will have to work on both wheels on the same axle, land rovers have a drum brake but its on the input shaft to the axle, and so will lock both wheels as a result.
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  #37  
Old 09-10-2010, 08:08 PM
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The quads I have seen with a single disc do not have a diff, they use a solid axle. This is possible because of the narrow track.

My point exactly.
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  #38  
Old 09-10-2010, 08:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4_stroke View Post
Jag stopped using in-board discs in 1993/4 (I was a project engineer on the 1993 model year XJS), type approval came in long before that. You can tell which one it is because it is the one with the profiled plastic bumpers. In the jag installation if the joint failed the suspension would collapse. But the type of joint used is a UJ which inherently fail safe. Itís a good neat set up. The only weakness was the diff in the V12 version. Not a problem for a trike.
Yup I believe that was due to "grandfather rights"

As I understand it type approval has not been applied to existing production models.

The Land Rover Defender still don't comply with all type approval.

Transmission park brakes are allowed.

Service brakes on a shaft with UJs are a grey area.

Anything with differential gears between the brake and the wheel aint likely to get through.

You will always come across anomalies cos the regs get applied differently across europe.

My advice still stands.
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  #39  
Old 09-10-2010, 09:26 PM
matthewmosse matthewmosse is offline
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This really gets to the crux of the issue, the trikes I've seen and refered to had nothing on the halfshafts or hubs in the way of brakes, the caliper was on the propshaft and was the main rear brake, it means it has been done, but that does not mean that it would pass msva today, once you get into the nitty gritty, you must question when was that done as the rules change also interpretations will vary over time and of course different people will read the rules differently, for most, playing safe and using conventional hub mounted calipers is a sensible option from a msva point of view as a fail can be dishartening. Quads with soild axles are a different ball game, intended for unsurfaced roads so 'cope' by scrubbing the tyres.
Quote:
Originally Posted by harry View Post
I agree with you, it's been done, most quads have single disc
on a drive shaft.

And yes most things like this are subjective... Thats the problem.

A jag rear end aint likely to fail when stopping a trike.

The problem comes when presented with a one off......How strong is it?

My only concern here is when investing huge amounts of time effort and money in a project, to then find you have a chance of it being rejected for the reasons stated. That's gonna hurt.

I know 'cos I've seen it first hand.
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  #40  
Old 16-10-2010, 09:54 AM
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you could fit inboard discs like on an old rover, using an opened sierra diff inside bearing plates plates, use bike discs on the output hubs, would need some kind of hub making between the shaft and the diff out put hub, use bike brakes, great stopping power then use a couple of these for handbrakes.

http://www.hispecbrake.co.uk/calipers/sva_spot.htm

over complicated really, but hey ho each to theri own.
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  #41  
Old 17-10-2010, 09:45 AM
mjb mjb is offline
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hi all , i have done away with that idea and gone for the standard sierra set up , but im leaving the disc on to confuse people !!
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  #42  
Old 20-10-2010, 04:49 PM
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My Harley back end is a BondBug, the diff is already split, you need to take the retaining bolts out of the side and cut away the front of the plate that you've removed so the chain clears the case.
From there you can take the crown wheel away and install the rear drive cog of your choice.
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  #43  
Old 20-10-2010, 06:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pablo View Post
My Harley back end is a BondBug, the diff is already split, you need to take the retaining bolts out of the side and cut away the front of the plate that you've removed so the chain clears the case.
From there you can take the crown wheel away and install the rear drive cog of your choice.
Hi Pablo,

Often seen them done that way, what do you do about the bearings that used to be lubricated by the axle oil?
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  #44  
Old 23-10-2010, 07:55 PM
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you buy sealed bearings from a bearing supplier
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  #45  
Old 25-10-2010, 09:48 AM
Terrortubby Terrortubby is offline
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I think it'd be better to mount the brake calipers and discs to the hubs.

If you mount them to brake a drive shaft and a UJ goes you will have no brakes as described in one of the comments abouve. You will also need a hand brake, you will need to fit it to operate on both rear wheels. I have seen some done to brake just the front wheel but most car calipers come with the hand brake mechanism fitted so you'd just need to sort the cable out.

Nice diff!

I have a load of pictures from my GSXR trike build with a IRS back end and would be happy to send them to you if you wanted a look.

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  #46  
Old 16-12-2010, 06:33 AM
Haggis-Landy Haggis-Landy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnr View Post
even a handbrake will have to work on both wheels on the same axle, land rovers have a drum brake but its on the input shaft to the axle, and so will lock both wheels as a result.
Erm sorry but your wrong there. If only one wheel is on the floor they will both rotate only in opposite directions. this is the reason you need chocks to jack up a Landy.
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  #47  
Old 23-05-2012, 10:05 AM
eddie axeman eddie axeman is offline
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am i missing somthing or could you have the brakes at the end like on most cars near the wheels
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  #48  
Old 21-05-2013, 05:00 PM
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Awesome work. Are you still making these? I will be looking for this sort of thing soon :-)
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  #49  
Old 13-08-2014, 09:54 PM
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sorry i don't make them any more i don't have the time
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