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  #1  
Old 21-08-2013, 03:18 PM
HardShoulderShoe HardShoulderShoe is offline
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Default YOU, the public, need protecting.

Here's one that pressed my anti-establishment buttons:

Apparently, there's a new type of mobile phone knocking about, that is contained inside a fake car key fob. The government are looking to ban it in the UK, mostly because of the potential that they can be sneaked into prisons (if the most part of the following BBC news story can be believed).

The story is here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-23782136

Putting aside the use of copyrighted logos argument, the problem for me is that I am an 'innocent' person, yet the government, in its wisdom, sees fit to curtail my freedoms because that's the easiest way to maintain it's own security.

Maybe I should just ignore it and be a good citizen?
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Old 21-08-2013, 05:17 PM
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(if the most part of the following BBC news story can be believed).
We're in the middle of the silly season, I wouldn't pay too much attention.
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Old 21-08-2013, 06:53 PM
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would you be giving a car-key fob to someone doing a stretch? Gov't can ban this all they like, the technology exists and will outstrip their efforts to keep it out of the 'wrong' hands.

As for being a good citizen as you've not personally lost anything...if you don't speak for others no one will speak for you. And the powers that be have decided that the bad behaviour of some bikers is justification to ban bikes on some stretches of road (near the Ace)
story linky

My way of looking at this - if you don't think the gov't has the power to do what they're doing, you're probably right. We have no formal constitution, our gov't relies upon our consent. Don't give it.
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Old 21-08-2013, 11:50 PM
HardShoulderShoe HardShoulderShoe is offline
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the powers that be have decided that the bad behaviour of some bikers is justification to ban bikes on some stretches of road (near the Ace)
story linky.
That's f*@king OUTRAGEOUS - can I get a discount on my VED?!? Twats.
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Old 22-08-2013, 08:11 AM
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The only response to that is to flood those inept council clown with complaints of anti-social motorists on a given road, if they don't respond then it's discrimination.

Arseholes.
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Old 22-08-2013, 12:27 PM
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Yup, that sort of shit needs nipping in the bud.
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Old 22-08-2013, 02:20 PM
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Star trek again..

Captain Kirk had the flip up mobile phone before us, now Picard has the badge phone so we have the key ring phone, I'm sure they can make it into a badge..

Anyway prisoners are allowed mobile phones, how else did Geoffrey Archer dictate his prison diaries that sold for 7 million quid..

John.
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Old 22-08-2013, 04:28 PM
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Star trek again..

Anyway prisoners are allowed mobile phones, how else did Geoffrey Archer dictate his prison diaries that sold for 7 million quid..

John.
Would beg to differ on this - think you will find that any mobile phone in a prison is not allowed and is deemed contraband
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Old 22-08-2013, 07:11 PM
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I'm wrong again, although thousands of mobiles are in use in prisons, it is illegal and the government is considering fitting a landline phone in all prison cells..

John.
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Old 22-08-2013, 07:43 PM
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Am I missing something here ?

Why would prisoners need car keys ?

Surely a key would make a good weapon ?

So why do they need to ban something that looks like a car key ?
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Old 23-08-2013, 12:25 PM
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I'm wrong again, although thousands of mobiles are in use in prisons, it is illegal and the government is considering fitting a landline phone in all prison cells..

John.
Heard on the radio yesterday that an insurance company (I think) are setting up call centres in two prisons where the inmates will ring customers (read general public - cold calling I suspect) to collect information on lifestyle etc.

So when the nice man or lady from the insurance company ring you to decide if they can offer you a great deal, you could be giving your personal information to a convict!
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Old 23-08-2013, 06:42 PM
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Heard on the radio yesterday that an insurance company (I think) are setting up call centres in two prisons where the inmates will ring customers (read general public - cold calling I suspect) to collect information on lifestyle etc.

So when the nice man or lady from the insurance company ring you to decide if they can offer you a great deal, you could be giving your personal information to a convict!
They do this a lot in the US. The ban on slavery doesn't include incarceration, so psuedo-slavery on the inside is a way of competing against cheaper Indian call centres or Mexican factories. Of course, there is now a financial incentive for States to hand out maximum penalties and do bugger all about crime prevention.
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Old 23-08-2013, 08:08 PM
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The house always wins.
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Old 24-08-2013, 09:47 AM
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They do this a lot in the US. The ban on slavery doesn't include incarceration, so psuedo-slavery on the inside is a way of competing against cheaper Indian call centres or Mexican factories. Of course, there is now a financial incentive for States to hand out maximum penalties and do bugger all about crime prevention.
Somebody slap him please for fuck sake. Several times. Then do it some more.

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Old 24-08-2013, 03:24 PM
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Somebody slap him please for fuck sake. Several times. Then do it some more.

Chopper
Err....ok, not exactly sure why a basic statement of fact has drawn such ire, but anyhoo.
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Old 25-08-2013, 12:17 PM
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Err....ok, not exactly sure why a basic statement of fact has drawn such ire, but anyhoo.
Simply because you do post a right load of alarmist bollocks. You really need to get out more and talk to some live people. Hanging around in graveyards is obviously clouding your thought process.

Fact = Statement of accurate information, not a conspiracy theory, paranoia, pinko idealism, human or civil rights propaganda.

They do this a lot in the US. The ban on slavery doesn't include incarceration, so psuedo-slavery on the inside is a way of competing against cheaper Indian call centres or Mexican factories. Of course, there is now a financial incentive for States to hand out maximum penalties and do bugger all about crime prevention.

Only someone with your tarnished view of the world would come up with such an idiotic theory.

People commit all manner of crimes which carry a prison sentence. Culprits are caught, hauled before a court, found guilty and sent to prison for a specified time.

It does cost money to keep convicts in prison. Tax payers foot the bill for keeping people in prison. The government is always moaning about how much it costs to run prisons. Tax payers frequently moan about the cost to them.

In America there are about 290.000.000 people. Pro rata, they have more criminals, they also have more prisons. Hence very high incarceration costs.

A long time ago, many countries realised that if you have large numbers of people couped up in cells they tend to get a tad restless. Hence the supposed drive to rehabilitate convicts. They do this in part by keeping prisoners occupied as much as possible. Some prisons use prisoners to do work that will either train them for future employment or contribute to the running costs of the prisons.

As for the prisoners? In my case, having done time, I can tell you that I would rather be doing something, than sitting in a cell twiddling my thumbs. I worked on the nick farm, once a year those inmates that had earned the trust, IE: were not likely to do a bunk, got the chance to do some potato picking on neighbouring land. We got paid a lot more than we normally did for working on the farm. It also meant we got outside and met people that were not prisoners or screws. A very welcome break, although very hard back breaking work. The profits from our labour paid for new TV and radio equipment in the nick. That was quite a long time ago. Things have moved on since then.

Hardly slavery is it? I doubt you can find any concrete evidence that proves the American justice system is sentencing convicts to longer terms simply to boost profits for the prison system. Bear in mind that the American system is known for much harsher sentencing than that operating in the UK. Why would they increase their prison over population problem, by imposing longer sentences when they have an abundant supply of new inmates being sentenced all the time? Competing with the Far East or Mexico is not likely to make it a financially rewarding exercise.

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Old 25-08-2013, 12:32 PM
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er, the evidence is in:

http://www.nola.com/crime/index.ssf/...ds_prison.html

https://www.aclu.org/prisoners-rights/private-prisons

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...-clean.svg.png

there is a case where a judge got jail for 'selling prisoners' to a private prison. there are deals done where private prisons have to have a certain number of prisoners-by contract, so judges imprison to keep up private profit.

there is nothing fair in the justice system.
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  #18  
Old 25-08-2013, 03:57 PM
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Default It's all about money.

It has been said that America has the best criminal justice system that money can buy.
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Old 25-08-2013, 04:47 PM
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Too many fucking hippies on this forum.
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Old 25-08-2013, 11:51 PM
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Originally Posted by mickturate View Post
er, the evidence is in:

http://www.nola.com/crime/index.ssf/...ds_prison.html

https://www.aclu.org/prisoners-rights/private-prisons

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...-clean.svg.png

there is a case where a judge got jail for 'selling prisoners' to a private prison. there are deals done where private prisons have to have a certain number of prisoners-by contract, so judges imprison to keep up private profit.

there is nothing fair in the justice system.
LOL, only in America.

Does actually prove my point though. People get arrested for committing an offence which if found guilty carries a term of imprisonment. If people do not commit offences and do not get arrested, then they do not go to prison.

So private prisons make a profit for the company that owns them. The tax payer is footing the bill. If the privately owned prison then makes a profit by using its inmates as workers, thereby making an additional profit for the owners, that is something the law makers need to look into. The report does not state what, if anything the inmates are paid for their labour. Nor does it say if the labour is voluntary.

Nothing fair in the justice system? Remember my last court appearance?

There is no justice, just us.

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  #21  
Old 26-08-2013, 09:19 AM
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There is no justice, just us.

Chopper
That's another way of saying, You don't go to court for justice you go to court for law.

Solicitors, Politicians and Judges could not do their jobs without knowing how to tell lies and I know for a fact that deals are arranged between all three at times, in this country.

John.
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Old 26-08-2013, 01:19 PM
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LOL, only in America.

So private prisons make a profit for the company that owns them.

The report does not state what, if anything the inmates are paid for their labour. Nor does it say if the labour is voluntary.

Chopper
Subtle difference...Louisiana State Penitentiary (the most renowned for this practice*) isn't a private prison being run for profit, it allows private firms to use inmate labour for the profit of the private firms - who in turn dodge laws on health care coverage, minimum wage, etc. The prison may gain some sort of financial reward, but as it's mainly state funded I'm not 100% sure they do.

I don't think we'll get this in the UK as we don't have a Republican Party, whose philosophy of sacrificing anything and everything on the alter of corporate profits now pervades all aspects of US political psyche.

*popularised in the UK by the Louis Theroux TV program on it where the Governor of the Prison was perfectly candid about using it as a method of garnering cheap labour to stop jobs moving overseas.
I don't have an opinion on the practice except that it isn't very helpful to employment and pay rates to the wider population (but then, those jobs were going abroad anyhow).
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Old 26-08-2013, 09:50 PM
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Many years ago I did an HNC, the law tutor opened his first lecture with:" Do not confuse the law with justice. The law is concerned with the interpretation of written rules. Justice is arbitrary There may be no connection"
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Old 27-08-2013, 12:58 PM
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Many years ago I did an HNC, the law tutor opened his first lecture with:" Do not confuse the law with justice. The law is concerned with the interpretation of written rules. Justice is arbitrary There may be no connection"
We had a barrister on a training course who said pretty much the same thing.
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Old 27-08-2013, 01:56 PM
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Get divorced. Particularly if you have kids. The farce that is the court system will be displayed in all it's glory.

If ever there was a place in which prejudice and class-division was alive and well...
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Old 27-08-2013, 05:17 PM
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". The law is concerned with the interpretation of written rules."

And therein lies the biggest problem with our legal system. There should be no need for "interpretation". The rules should be clear and concise, not full of double talk and waffle. If ignorance of the law is no defence, then make the law clear.
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Old 27-08-2013, 07:37 PM
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". The law is concerned with the interpretation of written rules."

And therein lies the biggest problem with our legal system. There should be no need for "interpretation". The rules should be clear and concise, not full of double talk and waffle. If ignorance of the law is no defence, then make the law clear.
If the law was clear we wouldn't need lawyers.

Many MPs are lawyers.
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Old 28-08-2013, 07:57 AM
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If the law was clear we wouldn't need lawyers.

Many MPs are lawyers, but still robbing, lying, backstabbing, hypocritical cunts.
Fixed that for ya mate.

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Old 28-08-2013, 08:55 AM
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Fixed that for ya mate.

Chopper
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Old 28-08-2013, 10:03 AM
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Fixed that for ya mate.

Chopper
Go on state the bleeding obvious.
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