Harley anybody ?

[DavieLights]

Just read over on HMVF that all the military Harleys are coming out of service and be up for sale / auction shortly . Photo taken at Witham Specialist Vehicles in Colsterworth showing present stocks .:eek:

[Sir Ewok]

A good buy for somebody, wish I had some spare cash......:(

[bird]

always thought they looked funky.



http://www.mod-sales.com/thumb/phpThumb.php?src=../images/product/1239091479HarleyDavisonMT350C2290%20001.jpg&w=400&h=340&zc=1&fltr[]=wmi|../images/over.png|CBR|100



http://www.mod-sales.com/direct/vehicle/,21,/21296/Harley_Davidson.htm#

[John Hopkins]

They are those horrible little single cylinder jobs.

Yukk.

John

[4_stroke]

A Harley in name only!

[harry]

A Harley in name only!

Insert Harley joke of your choice ;););)

[Hillbilly Deluxe]

Insert Harley joke of your choice ;););)

yawn,scratch arse,here we go again.:rolleyes:

[irishbiker]

I built one from a box of bits. I love pissing the chrome boys... yes it is a harley, yes thats a german engine.....

Engine is a bullet proof Rotax lump, 350cc tho I am on the lookout for a cheap 604e engine as it fits straight in.

Love the two electrical system, dynamo for the engine and alternator for the lights.

Could do with a parts bike might see what they are going for.....

[4_stroke]

I built one from a box of bits. I love pissing the chrome boys... yes it is a harley, yes thats a german engine.....

Engine is a bullet proof Rotax lump, 350cc tho I am on the lookout for a cheap 604e engine as it fits straight in.

Love the two electrical system, dynamo for the engine and alternator for the lights.

Could do with a parts bike might see what they are going for.....

£850 is the last "bid" price I saw on their web site. good(?) bikes going for about £1500 on e-bay

It is a Harley, but not one that the seem to be vary proud off, Unlike the Army bikes they made in the 40s

[johnr]

A Harley in name only!


yup, a fabulously reliable and handsome rotax that will be forever blighted by an unfortunate name!!!!!

[shaggy696969]

yawn,scratch arse,here we go again.:rolleyes:

It must fucking hurt you spent so much money for so many to take the piss ....... CZ's used to be so much cheaper.

[gollum]

yup, a fabulously reliable and handsome rotax that will be forever blighted by an unfortunate name!!!!!

That unfortunate name has been going for 106 years now, must be doing something right;):cool:

[4_stroke]

That unfortunate name has been going for 106 years now, must be doing something right;):cool:

Yep still one of the most iconic brands in the world. No other motorcycle manufacturer can hope to get close to the heritage of Harley Davidson.

[Far Canal]

Yep still one of the most iconic brands in the world. No other motorcycle manufacturer can hope to get close to the heritage of Harley Davidson.

And all because Jimmy Dean & Marlon Brando rode...Triumphs :D

[4_stroke]

And all because Jimmy Dean & Marlon Brando rode...Triumphs :D

The US has always been a big export market for UK bikes.

However the biggest export market for Harley Davidson is Japan!

So even the Japanese would rather have the real thing.

[johnr]

The US has always been a big export market for UK bikes.

However the biggest export market for Harley Davidson is Japan!

So even the Japanese would rather have the real thing.


whats coca cola got to do with it?:D

[johnr]

That unfortunate name has been going for 106 years now, must be doing something right;):cool:

youd think they had figured out how to build a single cylinder lump by now eh. still, i suppose they will crack on with one just as soon as they have got the twins right!!!:D:D

[shaggy696969]

That unfortunate name has been going for 106 years now, must be doing something right;):cool:

So many years so little progress. :rolleyes:

[robbum]

Based on its predecessor the armstrong MT 500 which i believe is canadian of all things

Sorry if i got it wrong

[Hillbilly Deluxe]

It must fucking hurt you spent so much money for so many to take the piss ....... CZ's used to be so much cheaper.

It does'nt bother me at all,but bike brand bashing is just boring.The bikes themselves are fine.Lot's of people that take the piss end up with one.:D

[shaggy696969]

It does'nt bother me at all,but bike brand bashing is just boring.

Erm ........... Nope it's not. :D:D:D

[gollum]

youd think they had figured out how to build a single cylinder lump by now eh. still, i suppose they will crack on with one just as soon as they have got the twins right!!!:D:D

:D only thing they got wrong is all the electronic shit they are now using and could do without ;)

[gollum]

So many years so little progress. :rolleyes:

Depends on what you call progress;) if its not broke why fix it ;)

[Louis]

The Buell blast 500cc has not been imported to the UK ....

[Louis]

Just to add some Fuel to the FIRE

[4_stroke]

Just to add some Fuel to the FIRE
:tumbleweed:

[shaggy696969]

Depends on what you call progress;) if its not broke why fix it ;)

Which expresses well the gullibility of the Harley market. ;)

[frenchie]

They are those horrible little single cylinder jobs.

Yukk.

John

couldnt have put it better
fren

[gurnE]

Based on its predecessor the armstrong MT 500 which i believe is canadian of all things

Sorry if i got it wrong


Armstrong was British. Although Canadian armed forces did use the bikes IIRC.

Always fancied one, they fetch too strong money though for a POS hack. :(

[gollum]

Which expresses well the gullibility of the Harley market. ;)

Or those that aspire to owning plastic shrouded lumps of tat, that they consider to be bikes:D

[strima]

Armstrong was British. Although Canadian armed forces did use the bikes IIRC.

Always fancied one, they fetch too strong money though for a POS hack. :(

Bit of history on the MT500:

There is quite a lot of history surrounding these bikes over the last couple of decades. They originated from the Italian SWM Tornado at the beginning of the eighties. Armstrong CCM got hold of the design when the company got into money problems. CCM at the time were also taking over the struggling Canadian Can-Am who happened to have the Military contract for the UK forces. All the companies used the Austrian made, Bombardier Rotax engines.

By the mid eighties production of the kick-start model was in full swing and I beleive the MOD purchased at least 5000 of these machines. The Canadian and Jordanian Armies opted for the lower compression electric start models.

In 1987 CCM Armstrong was sold to Harley Davidson. There are many stories about the takeover ranging from Military contracts to dirt-track racing, who knows which is correct.

The main reason for the MT500 being withdrawn from service in the early nineties was due to a change in the UK licensing laws. As the MT500 had a high compression engine, the brake horse output was higher than that legally allowed for a learner rider. The electric start MT350 was brought in and the Government gave dispensation to the UK Armed Forces to learn on a 350cc as the BHP was just below the legal learner limit. The MT350 is now only produced in the US but spares still come from Austria, France and the UK among others.

Military bikes are being phased out of mainstream use due to the upsurge in Quad ATV being more versatile. RMP & Tank Transporter will still be using the Pans and SF will do their own thing as usual.

[shaggy696969]

Or those that aspire to owning plastic shrouded lumps of tat, that they consider to be bikes:D

I see what you mean

[gollum]

I see what you mean


you got the wrong pic

[Mortis]

That unfortunate name has been going for 106 years now, must be doing something right;):cool:

Like Triumph which have been going a year longer :D

[Biker Buster]

A Harley in name only!

Phew! got away with that lightly then didn't they?

[4_stroke]

Like Triumph which have been going a year longer :D

Both iconic brands that struggled in the 70s and early 80s through lack of investment and strategic direction and both now very successful.

[kidhaf]

Like Triumph which have been going a year longer :D

Of which this weekend is the 50th Celebration of Triumph Bonneville to be held at Gaydon. This is going to be the biggest gathering of Bonnies ever held. We have 20 members of the Glasgow TOMCC going down and quite few others.

http://www.bonnevillecelebration.org/Default.aspx

[gollum]

Like Triumph which have been going a year longer :D

Unfortunately not true, they were reincarnated after closing and came out baring 1980 Kawasaki technology:D

Much improved now though, and the new cruiser looks cool;)

[shaggy696969]

Much improved now though,

Unlike HD

.........................

[Grav]

1980 Kawasaki technology:D



1984 to be a bit more accurate, the Hinckley Triumphs were based on the GPZ900R. The data gained from that development process has been used by both companies to further development of their engines in terms of reliability and optimum performance.

:cool:

[gurnE]

I see what you mean

I saw that Saturday. He really couldn't have bolted another bit of chrome on anywhere could he. :puke:

[gollum]

1984 to be a bit more accurate, the Hinckley Triumphs were based on the GPZ900R. The data gained from that development process has been used by both companies to further development of their engines in terms of reliability and optimum performance.

:cool:

I know I got a GPZ900RR;) minus the plastic!

[gollum]

Unlike HD

.........................

You clearly never owned one, never mind you will one day;)

[John Hopkins]

You clearly never owned one, never mind you will one day;)

It's possible, but highly unlikely.

I think Shaggy is waiting for them to sort out the new Vmax.

John

[gollum]

It's possible, but highly unlikely.

I think Shaggy is waiting for them to sort out the new Vmax.

John

Be worth waiting for!

[Mortis]

Unfortunately not true, they were reincarnated after closing and came out baring 1980 Kawasaki technology:D

Much improved now though, and the new cruiser looks cool;)

I never said it had been going continuously, just from 1902 :p

[John Hopkins]

I seem to remember in the early 80's Harley was in danger of going under because they spent too much money on quality, they used to make the bores mirror bright at great cost. Then someone had the idea that they should just rough bore them and let the oil do the smoothing. In desparation and with much dissent they tried it, and found that the bores lasted much longer and saved a load of money.

John

[gollum]

I seem to remember in the early 80's Harley was in danger of going under because they spent too much money on quality, they used to make the bores mirror bright at great cost. Then someone had the idea that they should just rough bore them and let the oil do the smoothing. In desparation and with much dissent they tried it, and found that the bores lasted much longer and saved a load of money.

John

Unfortunately John, its a shame that a little more money wasen't spent on quality these days, while ive always been able to accept that the old V twin is just that, old, and you either like it or you dont, there are plenty of other areas where things could be improved, I guess if you want quality these days the only way forward is to build it!

[Grav]

Triumph and Harley Davidson definitely suffered as a consequence of being left behind by the ferocious advance of the Japanese Bike manufacturers in the 70's. Triumph fell and Harley just about managed to stay in business. Both were hampered by a distinct lack of investment in up to date tools and processes that the Japanese literally ran away with.

The fact that both companies are still around is a testament to the power that their names still hold in the biking world. It's a shame that both companies had to endure so much pain in their troubled times and, in Triumph's case, rebirth.

[gollum]

Triumph and Harley Davidson definitely suffered as a consequence of being left behind by the ferocious advance of the Japanese Bike manufacturers in the 70's. Triumph fell and Harley just about managed to stay in business. Both were hampered by a distinct lack of investment in up to date tools and processes that the Japanese literally ran away with.

The fact that both companies are still around is a testament to the power that their names still hold in the biking world. It's a shame that both companies had to endure so much pain in their troubled times and, in Triumph's case, rebirth.

I think Triumph have probably come out of it a better company with a better product thats moved with the times, although its a shame that the Government at the time, were only prepared to loan money to keep them afloat, but had no problem pumping millions into BL.

[Grav]

Yep, and look what happened to BL. Re branded as the Rover Group and eventually sold off to the Germans who then sold it back at a massive loss to a management buy out that got millions more in funding from government before it was finally declared bankrupt and sold to the Chinese.

At least Triumph remained in British hands under the leadership of John Bloor. He knew the brand was strong and would be a success again providing the necessary investment was made. Many people in government thought his plans for the brand were doomed to fail so refused to give any funding. He had to use his own money he made from other business ventures to pay for the development of the new range. It was a massive gamble, but it has paid handsome dividends and is probably Britain's biggest success story of how a brand can be reborn.

[Pugwash]

having owned 40 odd bikes and just 1 Harley for a short period of time before it met mr angle grinder :p

i can see both sides of this ongoing story :rolleyes:

what makes me laugh the most is i spent 30 years slagging the fucking things off and know i own one

its a bike a V-Twin often copied but usually by people who try and compare it to either Jap V-Twins and who then mention Performance , Power e.t.c

thing is until you ride one you don't understand how that engine stirs summit inside its owner (no not his knob or wallet) i honestly thought i'd hate the thing its slow , lumpy as fuck on tickover , vibrates like a fuking road drill at certain revs......but it feels like a living breathing essencse and the noise is wicked

there again i also loved the sound of my CBX with a 6 into 1 pipe

some bikes cause lots of disscusion Harleys for lots of reasons

when you actually own one i listen to yer valued thoughts good bad or otherwise but if its from the they cost this much point of view then i've heard it all before i used to say it myself often enuf an whilst i agree they are fucking over the top with there prices they also hold there value

[gollum]

what makes me laugh the most is i spent 30 years slagging the fucking things off and know i own one





:D:thumbu:

[4_stroke]

Unfortunately John, its a shame that a little more money wasen't spent on quality these days, while ive always been able to accept that the old V twin is just that, old, and you either like it or you dont, there are plenty of other areas where things could be improved, I guess if you want quality these days the only way forward is to build it!

Not sure what you mean about "old" VTwin.

The Twin cam came out in 1999, the Twin cam B (balance shaft version) in 2000. 96ci versions were first produced in 2007. If you think the haven't changed much the its a fact they use forked rod ends on roller bearings and dry sump, years ahead of their time when this was introduced and still relevant today. If you think push-rods are old hat check out BMWs. If you know anything about engines you will also know that 2 valves per cylinder is the best configuration for low speed high torque engines as required in the cruiser style motorcycles.

If you want overhead cam go for the V-rod that came out in 2002.

Closed loop sequential fuel injection is standard on most models.

All these engines are good for over 100,000 with little more than an oil and filter change.

So what exactly is the problem with the technology?

[Grav]

There's nothing wrong with the technology, it's how it was delivered that exposed the quality to unreliability problems. Harley and Triumph were using tried and trusted technology but made with ancient tooling and materials. These days engines are precision made on CNC machinery from better casting processes, but back in the 70's most Triumph and Harley tooling was manual and open to a bigger margin of error. The failure of both companies to re-tool for the challenges ahead almost killed both of them.

[John Hopkins]

All these engines are good for over 100,000 with little more than an oil and filter change.

So what exactly is the problem with the technology?

Let's be honest about this.. We all have a favourite bike..The Harley V-twin is a cult bike, but it is a tortoise of a bike compared to many of the Jap bikes.

Harley riders are compared to tractor drivers, but a lot of Jap bike riders are compared with power rangers.

How many of you would be happy to keep the bike you have at the moment for the rest of your life.

If you can answer that question honestly and say you would, then you probably ride a cult bike, Harley, Triumph, Vintage, Custom, or like me an old Vmax. The rider who buys a sports bike will be lusting after the fastest model off the line next year, and again the year after.

John

[gollum]

Not sure what you mean about "old" VTwin.

The Twin cam came out in 1999, the Twin cam B (balance shaft version) in 2000. 96ci versions were first produced in 2007. If you think the haven't changed much the its a fact they use forked rod ends on roller bearings and dry sump, years ahead of their time when this was introduced and still relevant today. If you think push-rods are old hat check out BMWs. If you know anything about engines you will also know that 2 valves per cylinder is the best configuration for low speed high torque engines as required in the cruiser style motorcycles.

If you want overhead cam go for the V-rod that came out in 2002.

Closed loop sequential fuel injection is standard on most models.

All these engines are good for over 100,000 with little more than an oil and filter change.

So what exactly is the problem with the technology?

I ride one, have for over six years now, and love it for what it is, the company I worked for designed the fuel injection for it, that doen't make it cutting edge technology, nor would I want it to be. But quality wise there are areas where there is loads of room for improvement given what they cost!
The first area that springs to mind is in the brake department and thats just for starters;)

[4_stroke]

Let's be honest about this.. We all have a favourite bike..The Harley V-twin is a cult bike, but it is a tortoise of a bike compared to many of the Jap bikes.

I don't have a favorite bike. I enjoy all bikes. I have never owned a "Harley" but I have riden them on many occations (done about 10,000miles on them in total)

I just can't stand all this generalisation bollox.

Are all Harleys "slow"... No

Are all Jap bikes "fast"... No

There you have it!

Lets all move on.

[Hillbilly Deluxe]

Mine is slow,but when i open the throttle it goes fast enough,so im happy.I've had 62 bikes,most makes and styles,the only ones that i could'nt get on with were all Yamahas.

[shaggy696969]

Biggest problem was the 4 year strike at meridan. Definitely a better company now, better up-to-date products. HD on the other hand are stuck in a rut. Only the 1250 XR and the Vrod is ground breaking in anyway, but tradition rules there along with it s antiquated values. Buell led the way until HD bought the company and brought them down to their level. Although still a superior product, than the standard HD range.

[4_stroke]

Only the 1250 XR and the Vrod is ground breaking in anyway, but tradition rules there along with it s antiquated values. Buell led the way until HD bought the company and brought them down to their level. Although still a superior product, than the standard HD range.

The Vrod served two purposes
1) It gave HD a water cooled engine that will probably be required to meet future motorcycle legislation in the US (noise, emissions etc)
2) It expanded the product range into the "technical" cruiser market

Let’s not forget that the bikes, in particular the "big twins" are big, heavy but rugged, designed primarily for the American market. By that I mean their poor road conditions and extreme climate. If you don't know what I mean try riding out there. Their weight and handling makes them less suitable for European roads but they still compete with the Japanese cruisers.

To try and compare the big twins (Dyna, softail, tourers) with bikes like the V-Max would be ridiculous as they are not in the same market.

As far as Buell is concerned I have a 2001 X1 Lightning which has given me 7 years of trouble free biking fun. I would not trade consider trading in for a newer bike as I don’t particularly like their latest offerings. Not that there is anything wrong with them, they are just not my thing.

[shaggy696969]

A better compare would be the Big Honda Kawasaki or Yamaha V twins, plenty to choose from, or Triumphs Rocket3 or new Thunderbird 1700 Twin. That is def aimed at the us market. My biggest gripe about HD apart from the price is the appalling brakes, no excuse for that.

[4_stroke]

A better compare would be the Big Honda Kawasaki or Yamaha V twins, plenty to choose from, or Triumphs Rocket3 or new Thunderbird 1700 Twin. That is def aimed at the us market. My biggest gripe about HD apart from the price is the appalling brakes, no excuse for that.

At least now we are finally getting down to the detail. Yes Harleys have been blighted with poor braking in the past. A legacy of the American market (as are their cars) Not so much now though because many of the bikes have twin front rotors and much bigger rear disc. The other issue for me which is still prevalent is the quality of finish on the fixings. The plating is not good.

One feature I love is the left and right hand controls for the self cancelling indicators. Also the hazard light functions. Why don’t other bikes have this?

[Hillbilly Deluxe]

The chrome on mine is excellent quality,apart from the wheel rims,which is crap.The clear coating on the forks and yokes was crap.The brakes were ok,but easily made better by using non H.D pads.

[shaggy696969]

One feature I love is the left and right hand controls for the self cancelling indicators. Also the hazard light functions. Why don’t other bikes have this?

BMW's since the K series first came out has both these functions. But most Japanese bikes don't nor the hazard lights , .......... must resist must resist ..... nah fuck it :D


They dont need Hazards as often as HD do. :D:D:D

[Pugwash]

Oh shaggy wot Bike have you got :rolleyes: ?

[shaggy696969]

955i Speed Triple and a Vmax trike. And Pug how long did you own your Harley before it broke ?

[Pugwash]

955i Speed Triple and a Vmax trike. And Pug how long did you own your Harley before it broke ?

hasn't broke at all

oh it does 65mpg at 80mph two up with all me rally luggage :p

[shaggy696969]

So it didnt bugger the Stator within 3 weeks of purchase then ? Damn those RAC vans are econimical ehh

[Pugwash]

So it didnt bugger the Stator within 3 weeks of purchase then ? Damn those RAC vans are econimical ehh

Stator was buggered when i got it £38 to replace it so not too bad and it still didn't break down

its never been in a recovery truck not even mine :D

still for a 17 year old bike it seems to plod along nicely enuf :thumbu:

[shaggy696969]

Stator was buggered when i got it £38 to replace it so not too bad and it still didn't break down

its never been in a recovery truck not even mine :D

still for a 17 year old bike it seems to plod along nicely enuf :thumbu:



5-13-2008 09:00 PM
Pugwash
bugger it blown the Stator on me Harley
how difficult are they to change ?

any special tools needed ?

apart from the Stator wot other parts Gaskets e.t.c will i need ?


Was only going by your words, Jolly good not so bad then. Still loved yer swimming chop. Pity you had to sell that on.

[Pugwash]

Was only going by your words, Jolly good not so bad then. Still loved yer swimming chop. Pity you had to sell that on.

yer i miss that little black chop things move on the Project Bike when its finished will make up for that

then i'll have summit else to have fun on

course it being me first Harley Project i reckon i'll still know fuck all about afterwards :p

[bird]

http://www.yesbutnobutyes.com/archives/funnycomic_capwank.jpg



Gets coat, runs

[Sir Ewok]

You clearly never owned one, never mind you will one day;)

Why do HD owners always say that. I have been riding for 45 years and have never sat astride a Harley, let alone owned one and as I get older, the odds of having one are getting longer. I have nothing against them and a bike is something with two wheels, therefore most motorcycles qualify on those grounds. IF I was to own one it would be a WLA or WLC, so it wouldn't be decked in chrome and such, it's not my style, but each too his/her own......:p

Here's a few piccies of Harleys in service and one of a post war scrap sale.....

The bottom one is a Polish Sokol CWS M100, a licence built Harley with a 37mm Cannon on board, would be good for hidden speed camera vans....

[gurnE]

Harleys are shit.

I can say that now I've sold mine. :p:p

[shaggy696969]

Have you changed your job too ?

[gurnE]

Yea, months ago now. got fucked of with working every Saturday!

Plus a couple of other reasons.

[shaggy696969]

Dont blame ya that would do my sweed in too. Oh well, if anyone can voice experience , ;):D:D

[knuckle]

youd think they had figured out how to build a single cylinder lump by now eh. still, i suppose they will crack on with one just as soon as they have got the twins right!!!:D


First H-D was a single cylinder.......LOL
http://www.harley-davidson.com/en_US/Media/images/Content/Pictorial/H-D_History/hd38459c.jpg
So many years so little progress. :rolleyes:

The new water cooled Road King :D

http://i472.photobucket.com/albums/rr86/Todd8080/Custom%20V-Rods/Custom%20V-Rods%20760/V15.jpg

The chrome on mine is excellent quality,apart from the wheel rims,which is crap.The clear coating on the forks and yokes was crap.The brakes were ok,but easily made better by using non H.D pads.

Agreed!

http://www.harley-davidson-hangout.com/forum/attachments/hdrcgb-general/9783d1248453546-wheels-rusting-inside-safety-check-sp_a0398.jpg

[Sir Ewok]

At the end of the day, we, as bikers get through a lot of rides before we know what we REALLY want. It may be a Harley bobber, a chrome spaceship, race rep or whatever. I guess I've found one of the bikes I'd like to ride forever but I'm still looking in case there are others..... Who knows, a Fantic with a GSXR engine in it....................:eek::eek::eek:

[Hillbilly Deluxe]

How old was the wheel in that pic ?

[Biker Buster]

Just read over on HMVF that all the military Harleys are coming out of service and be up for sale / auction shortly . Photo taken at Witham Specialist Vehicles in Colsterworth showing present stocks .:eek:

WTF can I get one?

Anybody?

[The Beer Monsters]

WTF can I get one?

Anybody?
The link was fairly early on in the thread...

http://www.mod-sales.com/direct/vehicle/,21,/21296/Harley_Davidson.htm#

[Biker Buster]

Only a complete tosser would have missed that! :blush:

Thank you Sir!

*Buster skips merrily away, checking his handbag and purse for change*

[knuckle]

How old was the wheel in that pic ?

6 1/2 years and 57k on the clock.

Only a complete tosser would have missed that! :blush:

Thank you Sir!

*Buster skips merrily away, checking his handbag and purse for change*

Tell that to my main man at the indy I use for tyre changing! :mad:

ps I do all my other servicing.