Operation Focus (hidden camers vans)

[S Cat 6]

Operation Focus (hidden camera van)
Just to let you all know, here in High Peak/Derbyshire the Police are operating what they call "Operation Focus".
It is hidden camera vans (white) with NO markings solely to catch bike speeding: the Council/ Government funding body who are operating it (run by ex-coppers, they tell me) have told me this themselves.
They are not putting any signs up to let you know that the camera's there, nor saying on the net where it is, despite the Police telling us locals that they will always do this and the website (see link below) also confirming this and assuring us that all mobile camera/safety vans will be brightly coloured and not deliberately "undercover".

Having seen this after a ride out last Sunday I asked the Police if this was a speed van and got this E-Mail reply: " Yes I can verify there was a unmarked white van at this location on sunday the 2nd of August conducting speed enforcement. This is part of a special operation called Operation Focus which operates over the summer months aimed specifically at reducing motorbike collisions on certain rural roads around the county. If you have any queries please contact Ian Windmill on 01773 572969."

I spoke to this Mr Windmill over the phone and he confirmed that they were really solely concentrating on bikes in order to reduce the number of accidents in the area involving "collisions". He wasn't interested or at all amused when I asked him why they didn't try and stop the major other road user who tended to be involved in said collisions, etc, then (i.e. cars). Sounds to me just more like bigoted uneducated idiots against bikers!

This is the link to the police site that tells you all about it and where the camera vans should be, and how they should be marked - BUT IT DOESN'T MENTION THE UNMARKED ANTI-BIKE VANS, DOES IT???!

http://www.slowitdown.co.uk/index.html

So watch out for them

[John Hopkins]

It seems to me that some local bikers should take a ride out with a bedsheet and the words camera van ahead so that they can follow the van around.

The weather is nice and it could make a good ride out.

A few hundred bikers rolling back and forwards at about 20 mph around the unmarked van should slow the traffic down nicely and if stopped say that as there was no visible police presence, you decided on private traffic calming measures because so many cars had caused bike accidents in the area.

Just doing your bit for the community.

John

[Sir Ewok]

According to last months Mag magazine, they are using unmarked LORRIES in laybys, so watch out!!!!

[kentgpz11]

According to last months Mag magazine, they are using unmarked LORRIES in laybys, so watch out!!!!



They were using an unmarked Discovery & horse box in Wales last year, dodgy bastards !:thumbd::thumbd::thumbd:

[v8_trike]

:mad:

Flip up plate anyone

:thumbu:

[Gregg1100]

Who are the wankers giving these anti-biker police pricks the jobs in the first place.?

[wurzel]

If they are aimed at bikes does that mean they are ignoring speeding cars/vans/horses ? If so surely that is grounds for complaint of discrimination/bias and if not then they come under the guidelines

[robbum]

Just to let everyone know that central scotland police hire vans specifically for the purpose of putting cameras in them so watch out for hire vans as well

[gothtec]

Recent staticis show that this year as had a hugh increase in speeding fines given out to motorists....

Recent statics show that casualty rates in motor related accidents are at thier lowest since 1926 since records began...

Comparable figures that the current number of motorvehicles on the road is over 10 times that of 1926...

Somethings working, but its isn't speed cameras!!!

[John Hopkins]

Recent staticis show that this year as had a hugh increase in speeding fines given out to motorists....

Recent statics show that casualty rates in motor related accidents are at thier lowest since 1926 since records began...

Comparable figures that the current number of motorvehicles on the road is over 10 times that of 1926...

Somethings working, but its isn't speed cameras!!!

That can't be anywhere near right, I have film of me in a car in 1953 going down oxford street in london and I counted less than 12 cars passing me. that was during shopping hours.

There must be at least 1000 times the number of vehicles on the road since 1926, most deliveries were still done by horse drawn vans even in the 30s and even in the early fifties we still used horses for milk, coal, beer, bread, rag and bone and that was in london.

John

[irishbiker]

1953? You in a car? Just how old are you?....... :D

[harry]

Recent staticis show that this year as had a hugh increase in speeding fines given out to motorists....

Recent statics show that casualty rates in motor related accidents are at thier lowest since 1926 since records began...

Comparable figures that the current number of motorvehicles on the road is over 10 times that of 1926...

Somethings working, but its isn't speed cameras!!!

As a complete cynic I look at those stats and see the “spin”

They state casualties not RTAs if you look at a modern car all it’s internal and external components are radiused to prevent injury, crumple zones, seat belts (now with pre-tensioners) air bags and protective steering ie collapsible steering column.

All this is compulsory under type approval regs.

THAT’S why casualties are at their lowest.

[John Hopkins]

1953? You in a car? Just how old are you?....... :D

Sorry that should have read 1957.

John

[S Cat 6]

Just back to the plot for a moment (sorry chaps) - just put up another post: Go tell Derbyshire Police what you think of them!
Apparently, they want to talk to us!

[Sir Ewok]

Just back to the plot for a moment (sorry chaps) - just put up another post: Go tell Derbyshire Police what you think of them!
Apparently, they want to talk to us!

Doesn't mean they'll listen though......:mad:

[redditchcpl]

from a legal point of view and yes i do work in the legal proffesion, the roads that these unmarked vans are being used on, does the road have signposts saying there are speed cameras along that road.
you all know the signs, white background black camera shape.

if somebody can confirm yes or no then i will advise anybody as to what can be done if they have received a speeding ticket.

[v8_trike]

from a legal point of view and yes i do work in the legal proffesion, the roads that these unmarked vans are being used on, does the road have signposts saying there are speed cameras along that road.
you all know the signs, white background black camera shape.

if somebody can confirm yes or no then i will advise anybody as to what can be done if they have received a speeding ticket.



What frequency do the signs have to be? (1/2 mile, 2 mile intervals etc) or would one sign suffice?

[redditchcpl]

im going from memory at the moment but will check tomorrow just to be sure, the sign for a speed camera last for 1 mile, but in that 1 mile there can be any number of speed cameras. for instance you go past a sign that you think you know is a static camera(the big yellow ones that dont move, sorry but somebody will ask) you then go past the static camera at whatever speed is given for that road and know 100% that you got it right and were doing the said speed.
if while still in that 1 mile stretch you then go past a mobile camera say in a plain van and you are speeding you are bang to rights speeding.

this bit is important to you all so i will put it in capitals.
IT IS NOT THE CAMERA THAT HAS TO BE CLEARLY VISIBLE IT IS THE SITE OF THE CAMERA.
the only way to get out of a speeding ticket is to prove you were being chased or harrased, or by proving that the site was not clearly marked with a camera sign.

proof of the pudding so to speak and proves how stupid my own council is, they have just spent nearly a million quid on installing the overhead average speed cameras on the redditch to bromsgrove highway in worcestershire. they have been switched on for nearly 7 months now and nobody has been done for speeding.
why i hear you all shouting, because the clever plonka that held the budget for the install forget to get the signs made up and they have no money left at all.

i have got a cpl of ppl out of fines and points for this exact reason

hope this helps some of you

[redditchcpl]

sorry got the distance wrong its 1km not 1 mile, bloody europeans :D:D:D

[Sir Ewok]

We in the Northampton 'Home of the Speed Camera' have had average speed cameras for years but if you speed in the slow lane they can't see you. The twats think that you will be in the outside lane of the dual carriageway when speeding. The other way is to speed along the straight and then slow down for the roundabout and accelerate slowly through the camera on the exit. What you have to look for is that they sometimes use a camera van as well.......:eek:

[redditchcpl]

sir ewok that doesnt work with average speed cameras. they use average speed cameras so that you have to drive at the speed limit or slower over a set distance. there will be a camera above the lane/lanes when you enter the trap, and then another set when you exit the trap. the computer they are linked to then works out your average speed for that set distance. if your over their set limits(which are normally 10% +4mph) you will get a letter through your letter box.
the only thing in the bikers favour with average speed cameras is that they are always facing you. thus rendering the number plate recognition system useless.

[Biker Buster]

So what happens if you change lane between cameras? Do the cameras cross refer?

[redditchcpl]

yes is the simple answer if there is a camera for each lane

[4_stroke]

So what happens if you change lane between cameras? Do the cameras cross refer?


No they do not, this used to be a flaw in the system. You will find that now they usualy have several cameras so even is you switch lanes you will eventualy cross two in the same lane. The only other potential cheat is to tailgate a truck when passing a camer so your front number plate is not in the line of sight. Not recommended though.

Be warned there all calls for bikes to have front number plates....:mad:

[wurzel]

yes is the simple answer if there is a camera for each lane

Here is an interesting article and response about cameras in Kent that covers the lane changing question

http://www.kentnews.co.uk/kent-news/Why-Kent-will-keep-the-speed-cameras-some-can-beat-newsinkent14924.aspx?news=local

[redditchcpl]

so yes is still the simple answer if there are cameras above each lane

[Sir Ewok]

It DOES work in Northampton as I regularly do nearly twice the limit (50mph) and once actually went over double during an emergency run . My lad had been pushed through a closed window and had fled covered in blood and I couldn't be bothered with speed rules.....

It's possible that because we had the first average speed cameras in the country that they have now rectified a flaw elsewhere, but due to design restrictions they cannot do it here.....:thumbu:

[redditchcpl]

ok i see why some of you are not getting where im coming from.
all of the new average speed cameras now have the ability to read your plate in whichever lane your in and tell if you have tried to switch lane.
all new average speed cameras will be an entry and exit point and it wont matter what lane you are in.
so the simple answer is yes.

the old systems will be upgraded with 1 further camera placed 15metres behind the original camera. all of the computer tech will be upgraded to tell if you have changed lane and will stop all of cars trucks and anything else with a front number plate from switching lane.
so still the simple answer is yes.

bikes cannot be caught in any average speed camera or any of these new cameras which actually take a pic of the person driving because of the same thing no front number plate.

the only cameras which can get a bike is the gatso which takes a picture of the vehicle from behind, but did you all know that if that gatso camera has none of the white markings on the ground then it will not stand up in court.

hope this has cleared up any confusion. i might be blonde but i aint thick or dumb and do know my law very well. i have to its my job.:D

[redditchcpl]

p.s we are not trying to tell anybody that they can speed 30 and 40 mph speed limits are there for a reason and should always be stuck to religously.

cant see the point of a 50mph speed limit and think it sucks.

national speed limit signs to my hubbi means drop a cog and pin the throttle back as far as it will go. if it dont blow up keep going.

hubbi also has a drop down plate and also knows how to wheelie quite well.

even we get caught sometimes but we dont moan we put our hands up and say yes i did it your quite right officer im sorry. i think some of you on here would be suprised at how such a simple response can get you away with quite a lot, even if you do look like the meanest biker from hell.

[hacky]

ok i see why some of you are not getting where im coming from.
all of the new average speed cameras now have the ability to read your plate in whichever lane your in and tell if you have tried to switch lane.
all new average speed cameras will be an entry and exit point and it wont matter what lane you are in.
so the simple answer is yes.

the old systems will be upgraded with 1 further camera placed 15metres behind the original camera. all of the computer tech will be upgraded to tell if you have changed lane and will stop all of cars trucks and anything else with a front number plate from switching lane.
so still the simple answer is yes.

bikes cannot be caught in any average speed camera or any of these new cameras which actually take a pic of the person driving because of the same thing no front number plate.

the only cameras which can get a bike is the gatso which takes a picture of the vehicle from behind, but did you all know that if that gatso camera has none of the white markings on the ground then it will not stand up in court.

hope this has cleared up any confusion. i might be blonde but i aint thick or dumb and do know my law very well. i have to its my job.:D??????
your job is?

[redditchcpl]

i solicit for a living, and before any of you start oh god they are worse than coppers, dont forgte im trying to help you all here :drums:

[hacky]

only ask as im from churchill...lol.....

know a few in the force there...:D:D

[redditchcpl]

we are in smallwood right by b&q
plus hubbi is an ex copper lol:eek::eek::eek:

[hacky]

smallwoodistan...lol

:p:p

[redditchcpl]

thats the one lol, if you look in the cert18 section you might recognise me :o:o

[hacky]

haha.....been away for a while...people age.....lol....
anyway...if ya know(woodrow) dougie...im there somewhere(long time now mind)...:)
:thumbsu:

[redditchcpl]

the only dougie we know anywhere near woodrow is opposite the old griffin pub

[hacky]

griffin aint woodrow...its studley...:)..
you aint local then...??

[redditchcpl]

lived here all our lives if you read the post properly it says anywhere near woodrow :rolleyes::rolleyes::p:p

[hacky]

yeah same dougie..lol..truth is i cant be assed to read everything...lol
i got familly in woodrow,churchill,matchborough,winyates,and batchley...large familly...lol
:):)

[redditchcpl]

well thats most of redditch covered then lol did you move to get away from them all or was you sent away for being a bad boy :D:D

[hacky]

haha.....
:thumbsu:

[redditchcpl]

ok will make my own decision on that one then :drums::p:p